Restoring AE86 w/ 4AGE 16v + HKS ITB + Haltech E6X

[aceforever]

Does the ECU supply the extra fuel via Post Start Enrichment or is that built intrinsically into your ECU?

Thanks for the tid-bit about AFRs during the startup/warmup process. It'll help me a lot as I was trying to tune to 14.7 on a cold start. (now that I think about it, I feel pretty dumb as you mentioned before about cold engine needed more fuel to start. I didn't think the AFR would be affected as well)

I didn't have time to work on the car today. I've been thinking about how one of front wheels doesn't spin easily and I suspect it's the caliper. How would you go about checking this? I suppose taking the wheel off, taking the caliper off and then try spinning it? I'm guessing the caliper is going to be hard to get off. If I do need replacements, I'm also guessing I should replace both front brakes at the same time. Any tips on a set that won't blow my budget? I guess I should pick up some lug nuts too as the ones I have are rusted and I don't have a key for the stupid special lug nuts.

Thanks a lot man. I really appreciate your advice.

[jondee86]

Does the ECU supply the extra fuel via Post Start Enrichment or is that
built intrinsically into your ECU?

On the E6X it is handled by the COLD START PRIME MAP. This gives one decent
squirt of gas at the onset of cranking, equivalent to pumping the throttle to prime
an old school carb engine. Default setting appears to be 40ms.

There is also an IGNITION CRANK MAP which sets the ignition timing below the rpm
at which the engine is deemed to be running. Above this rpm the ignition timing reverts
to the IGNITION MAP. The default cranking timing appears to be 15deg, but starting can
often be improved by retarding the timing during cranking to something like 10deg. No
need to mess with these maps if the engine starts OK; just leave them for now.

This guy has made a lot of DIY videos for the AE86. He tends to be a bit pedantic, and
progress is often painfully slow, but he does cover the various topics quite thoroughly.
I have not watched this one...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ahTzxwhiots
... but it should give you an idea of what to expect. You should be able to buy seal kits
and some special rubber grease from any decent autoparts store, and most of what has
to be done is common sense. Clean away any corrosion on the caliper bore and piston,
fit new seals, lubricate the sliders etc. Get a set of these brake line spanners...



They are essential for opening brake lines and fuel lines without rounding off the nuts.
Take the offending caliper off and strip it down (don't lose the springs clips !!!) and
see what is binding. You most likely will find that either the sliders have seized up
or the piston has stuck inside the bore due to accumulated crud/corrosion. If there is
pitting or scoring in the caliper bore that does not clean up with fine wet and dry paper
and green Scotchbrite, that is when you go looking for rebuilt calipers.

Cheers... jondee86

[YoShImUrA]

I recently redid my AW11 calipers and they're near identical.

Get them out of the car (make sure you put the brake line open end as high as you can or either use a vice grip to close it and prevent it from losing fluid and making a mess.



This was the fucker that was all seized up. The seal was such a mess it was only barely hanging from the piston.



Hence, a lot of dirt and grime that prevented it from moving:



You just clean them up all around well with gasoline (not with the seals on!), polish (if needed) the sliding surface of the piston and fit the new seals.









No need to disassemble anything as in the videos (I bought the SST tool, but only good if you're replacing everything, which I did on my rear ae86 calipers, which I recently rebuilt as well, but no need, really!).





The only thing you need to be sure is to turn the piston clockwise to put it in its original position and line the two piston mark thingys vertically, so that they line up with the mark on the caliper, in order to fit with the small nipple on each inner pad. Maybe that last bit sounded confusing due to my lack of English terminology, but once you see it you'll figure it out.

This is with the piston pushed all the way back in (you'll need a special tool or a fitting wrench within those two marks to spin it, again clockwise only to get it in!!). In this pic it still isn't lined up properly with the pad's nipple. This one would need another 90 deg crank approximately.



Fit it back, bleed the brakes (since you rebuilt it and removed everything previously, for a proper bleed I'd recommend you to get new pads and rotors, so that the piston has something to fight against before coming out, and the air goes out better, when pumping the pedal for bleeding.



Ask me if you have any questions.




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[aceforever]

The engine starts up after maybe three times of starting. Perhaps I should adjust the cold start prime? My guess is that after a few starts, there is enough fuel for a good start? Sometimes when I start the engine, the engine hovers at around 100rpm and then finally idles at 1500rpm. (I also really need to take care of that stupidly high idle, I've blocked off the ISCV entirely for now, but it's still high. Need to fiddle with the stop screws and perhaps get new springs?)

Haha that guy! I didn't know he had brake videos. He has great content! But like you said, his delivery could be a little better He does mention that you need a special service tool that holds the spring holder in place when placing that into the assembly. Would I need something like that? EDIT: saw YoShImUrA's reply.

I've seen EricTheCarGuy's video on honda brakes before and this one looks quite similar. I'm guessing the operation and theory behind brake calipers haven't changed much. I'll put this onto the list and acquire flare nut wrenches!

EDIT: Thanks YoShImUrA! Those pictures are much faster to consume than the video. Also, that piston looks so clean I could eat off of that! Well done!

[YoShImUrA]

No probs. Glad to help after all the times I've been helped.

Btw, about that tool for removing the brake lines, I've always used my open end from the 8mm combination (gear)wrench and had no rounding off issues.


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[jondee86]

Each time you crank a cold engine and it doesn't fire, it leaves fuel lying
in the manifold and cylinder. After a few tries you get to the point where
there is enough fuel lying about to start the fire. So yes, bump that Cold
Start Prime up to 60ms and see if it makes a difference.

The engine running at 100rpm and trying to decide if it should stay running
or not, will be a combination of not enough fuel getting to the cylinder and
too much ignition advance. After you have checked to see what difference
more priming fuel makes, you could try setting the Ignition Crank Map to
10 deg and see if that helps it to get away better.

Right now while you are experimenting, idling at 1500rpm probably helps,
as the engine will appreciate a bit more air for starting. If you had the AAV
working, or an ECU controlled ISCV, they would be letting in even more air
during cranking (cold start idle speed is 2200rpm on a factory AAV engine).

The AE86 front caliper is quite straightforward... it does not have that
wind-in detail. You can push the piston back by hand. The wind-in detail
only happens on the rear calipers, and short nose pliers work for winding
the piston back. As a sidenote, I recommend using green Scotchbrite pads
for cleaning finished metal parts, as it will remove the crud without
removing any of the metal.

@YoShImUrA
If you haven't rounded off any nuts you haven't been trying hard enough

Cheers... jondee86

[aceforever]

Thanks jondee86, I'll play with those settings.

Looks like from that guy's video for the front brake calipers, he uses compressed air to force the piston out. Will I need something like that to get it off, is there another way?

[jondee86]

You are a DIY guy... there is always another way

Take the caliper off the disc but leave it connected to the brake hose.
Carefully push the brake pedal down and... VOILA !! The piston will be
forced out of the bore Put some old rags or a pan under the caliper,
as some fluid will come out with the piston. Then disconnect the hose
from the caliper and start work.

Cheers... jondee86

[YoShImUrA]

Wouldn't hurt to put the rags previously, so that the piston doesn't get damaged when it pops out


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[aceforever]

Another tuning attempt. Going pretty well.

I played with Fuel Priming Map and adjusted it to around 65ms. It seems like the engine still hovering at 100rpm. So before adjusting the priming any higher, I lowered the Ignition Crank Map to 11degs and it seems to be starting better!

I was also playing around with tuning the Fuel Map and getting around 14.7 AFR at 1500rpm with no throttle. The TPS sensor is really bad for some reason. TPS was set to 0% during engine off and during engine on, it hovers around 7-9%. Whenever I even touch the throttle, the TPS value goes to 0%, then after much throttle pedal depress, it starts going higher. Maybe the potentiometer inside the TPS isn't doing well?

At this point, I decided that I should give MAP sensor as load a try. It was working much better for 1500-4000RPM tuning with little throttle. Haven't tuned the WOT yet so I assume based on your previous advice that that would be harder. With the haltech and the injectors I have, the engine likes around 1.5 to 1.6ms injection



Here's a video of the progress so far.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niWra_u9nV8

----

I'm still getting some electrical issues, after I shut off the engine, sometimes the whole cabin has no power. The door open light doesn't turn on, no clock in acc, etc.. I've tested the Dome Fuse with a multimeter and it indicates 5.5V instead of the normal 12V. After 5-10minutes, everything returns back to normal. I need to trace down the issue here.

I also notice the charge light flickers a little bit after the engine starts up initially, not sure if this is normal.

[jondee86]

Video looks good... engine seems to rev good without any stumble when you
blip the throttle

The TPS sensor is really bad for some reason.

You need to check how the TPS is installed to the ITB. In the stock mounting
the TPS operating arm is "pre-loaded" to eliminate any slack in the mechanism.
This is done by inserting the TPS rotated 10-15 deg from its fixed position,
and then turning the TPS back so that the spring-loaded TPS arm is rotated
forward by the throttle spindle arm.

This means that when the TPS is fixed in position, the TPS potentiometer
arm is already rotated forward by 5-10 deg, and is pressed firmly against
the spindle arm. No slack in the mechanism and no "off the scale" dead spot
before the TPS potentiometer starts reading movement.

Worth checking just in case there is a mismatch when mounting the TPS.

Cheers... jondee86

[jondee86]

the engine likes around 1.5 to 1.6ms injection

My engine likes to idle at around 3.4ms with 235cc/min injectors. Possibly that
is because of the cams I am using, and the way I have them set up. I have very
little manifold vacuum at idle, and most likely quite a bit of reversion, so need
more fuel to overcome that. You should use whatever works best... the actual
ms of injector opening time is related to your (unknown) injector rating, so if
1.6ms works, that is what you should use

Stock cams would give better idle vacuum which would allow the possibility of
using the map sensor for load sensing. I actually have a map sensor hooked up
to assist with the accelerator pump function. It reacts lightning fast to changes
in throttle position, but just goes to atmospheric by 25% throttle opening. That
is not enough range for good control.

Cheers... jondee86

[aceforever]

I've played with the TPS quite a bit it seems okay during engine off. When engine is on, it doesn't work very well. I think I have another TPS sensor somewhere in the junk bin, maybe I should try swapping the two?

I was trying to align my front tires. Currently they are a little bit to the right when steering wheel is centered. Also I can turn the steering wheel left more than I can turn the steering wheel right when starting from steering wheel center. I'm not sure how the steering system works, but perhaps some gear was not slotted in correctly?

So if my injectors are set to 1.6ms, and usually it's around 3ms, does that mean my injectors are higher than 220cc? Or perhaps some setting in the ECU calculates it differently?

Progress update: I was derusting some of the engine underside and engine bay underside. Plenty of surface rust that needs to be treated.

Tomorrow I'll probably start working on trying to get the lock lug nuts off tomorrow to try to fix that brake issue.

[jondee86]

I think I have another TPS sensor somewhere in the junk bin,
maybe I should try swapping the two?

Sounds like a plan. After a lot of use the track on the carbon film
potentiometer can get damaged at the point of maximum wear, which
is usually at the idle/just off idle throttle position.

Currently they are a little bit to the right when steering wheel is centered.

Two options here... the first one is to pull the steering wheel hub off the
spline on the top of the column, and put it back one spline to the left/right
as required. If that doesn't do it, then you can try the undercar route

You need to adjust the tierod ends. Loosen off the clamps or locknuts
that fix the tierod ends to the rack ends. You will need to adjust one
side so that the thread engagement is increased, and the other side so
that the thread engagement is decreased. Rotate the rack end to do
this by using a big adjustable spanner on the two flats provided.
Rotate each side by exactly the same number of turns !!! And don't
forget to lock the tierod ends up again when you are finished

Does that mean my injectors are higher than 220cc?

On the E6X you are inputting injector duration times directly to the ECU.
Thus, smaller injectors will run leaner and larger injectors will run richer.
However, there is no way of making a comparison between two different
engines due to the difference in Volumetric Efficiencies. My engine may
be less efficient than yours at idle due to the cams etc. But higher in the
rpm range the V.E. of my engine may improve more than yours to the
point where it uses less fuel at a given rpm and throttle opening

A quick trawl thru the E6X software does not show anywhere that you are
asked to enter the injector cc/min ratings, so basically the ECU does not
care. It just delivers the ms of fuel that is entered in the map. However,
it is unlikely that the previous owner of your car will have dumped a set
of stock injectors only to replace them with aftermarket units of the same
rating. I would guess they are rated higher than stock... but how much
higher ??? And this could result in a lower required injection duration.

Cheers... jondee86

[aceforever]

I tried the undercar route and it seems like my tie rods are pretty much seized. Where are the two flat spots for adjustable spanners?



The right side of the L width I see a hex nut there. That nut is pretty rounded looking though.

Also noticed that my lock nuts do not have locking pins.

Seems like my brake lines are SAE 5/8inch hex nuts (Around 16mm). I'll have to go out and buy a wrench since I don't have open wrenches of the 5/8in size.

[jondee86]

OK... you got me It's been a while since I was under there, and the two flats
are on the other side of the knuckle and used for breaking the rack end away
from the steering rack. You need to use that square/hex part of the spindle for
turning it around for adjustment.



Since you have the FSM open,.. did you note that the distance "L" should be the
same on both sides of the car (assuming that both sides have identical tie rod
ends). If one side is significantly longer than the other, there will be a tendency
for the car to pull to one side or the other.

WD40 is your friend And if you have the clamp type rod ends, you could try
loosening the clamp bolt and then using a big screwdriver to spread the slotted
part a fraction and help the oil penetrate.

Cheers... jondee86

[aceforever]

GOOD NEWS! I was able to adjust the tie rods! I noticed from your picture that they were actually ball joints there. So I left everything everything bolted on and used a open wrench to rotate that hex bit. I had PB blaster laying around so I used that to get everything loosened. Your tip of using a big flat edge to spread the slotted part is genius! Totally worked for me.

Anywho, the recommended distance wasn't working for me. It made the wheels face inward at the front kind of like / \ if top is the front. So I adjusted the tie rods closer in making sure that both sides are equal distance. Hopefully that wouldn't cause the pulling effect you mentioned. I used a string as a guide using the back wheels as a reference to align the front ones. This isn't perfect, but it is way better than before.

The steering wheel is very off from center, however at least the tires are facing the right way.

[jondee86]

You did the right thing Having the alignment correct is more important
than where the steering wheel sits at the moment. Now you can have a look
at getting the steering wheel hub off the column. There is a big nut in the
center that holds the hub on a spline. Depending on how tight the hub is
wedged onto the spline, sometimes you can "bump" is loose by thumping
the back of the steering wheel with both hands at the same time.

Loosen the nut off, but leave it on the end of the shaft by a couple of turns.
Then thump the wheel like a crazy man. If you're lucky the hub will pop off
the spline... and if you don't have the nut on the end of the thread, it will
hit you in the face I never tried this method with a quick-release adapter,
so consider yourself to be breaking new ground

If you can't move it that way, you will need to get hold of a steering wheel
puller. Once the hub is off you can try putting it back on center. But I would
suggest you do that when you can drive the car straight on a flat, level road
or deserted parking area, and stop with the wheels pointing dead ahead.

Cheers... jondee86

[aceforever]

Great! I'll put the steering wheel centering on the backlog since there are other things I'd like to fix up first. I'll keep those tips you have in mind.

I still need to replace my coolant and put on a radiator. When I was testing the system a couple days ago, it seems like there are no leaks normally. When I pinch the top inlet hose, water starts trickling out. Maybe I just need to put a new clamp on that. That said, there is a TON of gunk in the radiator. I'm thinking of keeping the radiator on for the time being and just change out the coolant.

I have some 75W90 already opened to lubricate the engine first crank, do these fluids degrade like brake fluid? Should I use it on the transmission/diff some point soon?

I was also playing with the other TPS. It seems pretty similar in the sense that the value dips down a little when I apply a little force. It does seem a little better though. When I was playing with the throttle, it seems like 50% pedal travel gives 90% TPS. is the travel supposed to give the exponential value like that? It seems way high. Perhaps there's some theory I'm missing here and it's supposed to be like that.

My goal is to make the car drive-able and ready for the tuner. Here's my to do list:

- get lug nut lock off
- brake check / fix
- brake fluid flush
- clutch fluid flush (a friend recommend this to me since when I have the clutch press down, and try to put the gearbox in reverse, it started grinding)
- coolant change
- finalize wire harness
- fix electrical issue

Stretch goals:
- transmission oil check
- diff oil check
- steering wheel centering

Do these make sense? Anything I should prioritize higher or don't have?

[aceforever]

The electrical issue also happens when I try to do a headlight flash without car running. Time to sit down how electricity flows through there.

[jondee86]

Maybe I just need to put a new clamp on that.

Over time the rubber in hoses compresses down and the clamps are no longer
as tight as they should be. So good idea to go over all the clamps and make
sure they are tight. Get the car out into the yard and use the garden hose to
flush the radiator and engine. Keep working at it until no more rusty water
comes out. Fill the system with tap water and run the engine until fully warm
with the heater on full heat. Drain the water out and refill with the proper
corrosion inhibitor/distilled water mix.

I have some 75W90 already opened...

Stuff lasts almost forever if you keep the cap screwed on. Later, when you
have had the car out on the road a few times, you can crack open the fill plugs
on the diff and gearbox. Make sure you can open the fill plugs before you open
the drain plugs for obvious reasons Then you can drain the oil and refill
with your choice of oils.

I was also playing with the other TPS.

It is just a rotary pot, so the response should be more or less linear with rotation.
Did you check to see if the TPS was "pre-loaded" when installed ? Did you calibrate
the TPS in the E6X software ?

Do these make sense? Anything I should prioritize higher or don't have?

Safety related matters rate higher than driveabilty matters. So, tires, brakes,
lights, wipers and washers, steering, horn, drivers seat secure, mirrors etc.
Then items relating to stopping and starting the car... Ignition, clutch, gears,
fuel supply, door latches, wires secured, belts tensioned, fluids topped up,
battery secured, no loose items rolling around inside the car etc.

Cheers... jondee86

[aceforever]

Thanks for the coolant change tips! And I'll leave the 75W90 for after I drive the car a bit. Thanks for that as well.

I calibrated the TPS myself in both cases. There are no other setting on the TPS setup. Perhaps there's a setting elsewhere. Either way I'm probably going to stick with MAP sensor as it is more reliable for me and let the tuner tune the TPS if that has an issue.

That reminds me, my wipers are missing a harness I think. It's just a connector. Will probably have to see what harness I'm missing.



Also I have no idea how the horn works with this aftermarket adapter. I see two connections on the thing so perhaps if I short those two the horn will fire?

Finally, GREAT NEWS. Figured out my electrical issue. After unplugging many many relays and fuses, I figured out that unplugging the Dome fuse that helped everything function correctly again. I'm going through the wire diagrams now to see what exactly is wrong in that circuit.

[jondee86]

Also I have no idea how the horn works with this aftermarket adapter.

The horn is activated by grounding to the steering column. The horn button
should have two leads connected to the "lift off" part of the quick release hub,
and there will be two pins/contacts between the two parts of the hub when
they are clipped together. The fixed part of the hub will have at least one
wire connected to power. There may of not be another wire for grounding.

That's how my quick release hub worked, but the details will vary between
different brands. As it happens I removed the quick release and replaced it
with a fixed spacer, as the horn contacts between the two halves of the hub
were poor, and the horn barely worked.

Cheers... jondee86

[aceforever]

I tested the contacts on the steering wheel and steering adapter. No voltage on any contact. I'll have to trouble shoot this later.

So today, I was testing the car and it seemed like all electrical problems were gone. I took my car out for the first time. Drove it around the block. Everything was great! My car is half-gutted (everything behind the front seats are gutted for cleaning and de-rusting. The car accelerates quick even at 3-4000RPM limit I set for myself. I've only driven manual cars on iRacing and maybe 1 hour of road time experience with a friend before, but this is a whole new level. I can hear the the mechanical parts below me making whining noises. The car is light and turns great. It's awesome! I felt like I was in a racing car. I had a ton of fun! For a short while...

What followed was the most anxious, most embarrassing moment I had with the car. I stalled out at a stop light. To make it worse, I had what seems like total lost of power to the car (the same electrical issue from before). I could not restart the car at all. It was rush hour and I was on an arterial residential road. Everyone was trying to get back home. Cars were piling up behind me, and I could not put hazards on. After disconnecting the white wire from the positive battery fuse. And reconnecting a few times. I finally was able to get power! I started the car up, carefully drove it into the alley way. All good now right? Nope, the alley way has a little incline.

Did I mention I don't know how to drive manual cars? I stalled my car on the incline. Luckily I was able to get the people working at the restaurant next door to help me push the car. It took 4 people to push the car into my garage.

I'm currently cutting up the electrical tap surrounding the wire harness and mapping out the wires since they're not exactly like what the EWD shows.

[jondee86]

All the highs and lows of owning an AE86 in one day = PRICELESS

Cheers... jondee86

[aceforever]

Hahaha. I wish it wasn't all in one day lol.

So when you have the engine running and turn on hazard or turn signal, your interior dash lights don't flicker right?

Also noticed whenever the blinkers are on, my charge light turns on. Seems like there's a short somewhere or something might not be grounded correctly.

[aceforever]

I think my alternator is bad. When I'm running the engine, and I test the voltage of the battery. It displays 12.45V. Manual says 13 or greater at 2000rpm

[aceforever]

Any idea on how to remove this bolt holding the alternator in? I unscrewed it until the rotation action doesn't move the bolt out anymore. I tried hammering it, no luck. Alot of pb blaster and wd40 has been applied.

[jondee86]

That will take some ingenuity. If you have tried tapping it out with a
pin punch or similar steel tool, and that did not work, you need to devise
a way to apply force to the bolt while turning it.




The threaded end of the bolt should now be some way inside the "tube"
thru the alternator casting. It is most likely held tight by a buildup of
corrosion products. However, if you can still rotate the bolt with a socket,
all is not lost. Use another bolt, piece of steel rod, pin punch or similar
inserted in the back of the tube to press against the end of the long bolt.

Create a lever from whatever you have laying around (piece of wood works)
so that you can wedge it in the engine mount and apply steady pressure
to the end of the long bolt. With one hand apply pressure, and with the
other rotate the bolt with a socket. You will be able to "unscrew" the bolt
more or less as if it was threaded in there. It might help to put the top
adjuster bolt back in to help stop the alternator dropping down at one
end and making the job harder.

Cheers... jondee86

[aceforever]

Thanks jondee! I came to the same conclusion



Need a much longer bolt though. Only pushed it a little after screwing it in